Why Abortion Rights Are Important
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Jason Donner

Jason Donner devoured the universe and you are all living inside him.
  • Karl Popp

    So, tell me. In any pro-life comments you’ve read, have you ever come across a phrase like, “you goddamn pro-choicers?” Yet the bulk of the “abortion rights” crowd considers the opposition to be “haters.” Also, while my heart goes out to those who wanted their unborn child and were circumstantially not able to have him/her (notice I didn’t say “it”), the majority of abortions performed are nothing more than birth control after the fact on the part of someone who didn’t accept responsibility sexually and isn’t willing to accept the responsibility of parenthood. And, news flash, it’s not the baby’s fault you got knocked up.

    • Jason_Donner

      So, tell me. In any pro-life comments you’ve read, have you ever come
      across a phrase like, “you goddamn pro-choicers?”

      Yes. Several times. I’ve also seen the phrases “baby murder,” “whore,” “slut,” and various descriptions of how the said person getting an abortion (for whatever reason) is going to hell.

      I’m going to introduce you to a term now called “body autonomy”. I’m paraphrasing here from something a read a few months ago.

      Did you know that it’s illegal to force someone to donate blood to another person even if that other person’s life is in immediate danger? Did you know that it’s illegal to even take organs from dead people because even a corpse has bodily autonomy. It’s a fundamental concept and right that everyone in this country enjoys because your body is your property and to require that someone give up that property even for life-saving services is incredibly unethical.

      So, you’re saying that, if a person becomes pregnant, they should be required to sacrifice their bodies for a biological process that is invasive, painful, dangerous, and expensive for the sake of what you see as a human life which is extremely debatable given the extremely early stage of development when the VAST number of abortions are performed.

      You’re actually suggesting that a woman has less rights to her body than a corpse.

      But let’s say that we go an live in this magical fantasyland where every mother is forced to become an incubator and every fetus becomes a baby. Do you really want babies born into families that can’t take care of them? Do you really want a larger welfare state? More takers? Most pro-lifers I know are conservatives who don’t like that kind of thing… you know: Love the fetus, hate the child.

      But let’s say you’re still sitting there thinking about how illegal that abortion should be. Here’s the thing: According to the long-standing rule of government going all the way back to the dawn of recorded history, your life officially and legally begins… on your birthday, not nine months before. According to law and country, you are not a person until you plop out of your mother. Not before… right then and right there. No law has ever granted legality to a person before that point. Ever.

      Are your objections religious? Genesis 2:7 states “And the Lord God formed man of the dust of the ground, and breathed into his nostrils the breath of life; and man became a living soul.” Not conceptions. Not a few weeks into the pregnancy… you don’t get a soul until you breath your first breath.

      Not convinced? I’m sure that the bible has SOMETHING to say about abortion.

      It does actually. Numbers 5:27. “If she has made herself impure and been unfaithful to her husband, this will be the result: When she is made to drink the water that brings a curse and causes bitter suffering, it will enter her, her abdomen will swell and her womb will miscarry, and she will become a curse.”

      Yeah, those are instructions on how to perform an abortion.

      In the bible.

      As part of God’s law.

      I’m sure that I could sit here and provide reason after reason why abortion rights are important, but the most important thing I can say is this: It’s not your damn business what someone else does with their body. You’re not in line to adopt an unwanted child, you’re not going to provide the women you forced to give birth any diapers, baby food, or clothing… it doesn’t affect you in the slightest, so why do you care? What business is it of yours?

      It’s not. End of debate.

      • Karl Popp

        Nice of you to quote a source you don’t believe when convenient for you. I won’t go into the differences between Old Testament law and the New Testament age. It wouldn’t matter to you. As far as “body autonomy” goes, try telling that to a prospective employer who wants you to give up bodily fluids for drug screening. Tell it also to the fetus (which I believe is a LIFE but even you have to admit is ALIVE if you are honest). What gives someone the right to take away ALL the rights of an unborn child? You and I will never see eye to eye.

        • Jason_Donner

          Given that so many use the Bible to justify their morality and want to use it as a means to enact laws, you’re darn right I’m going to quote it when a question of morality comes up.

          As for the drug screening argument, you’re being asked to pee, not remove an organ nor are they using said pee in a manner that wrecks the body nor inconveniences the donor. It’s a waste product naturally expelled and, you always have the right to refuse even if that refusal leads to the loss of employment.

          At a certain point, a fetus does become a viable lifeform, but that point is way beyond the customary timeframe that abortions take place. I would tell this to a fetus, but it does not have a functional brain by this point. I would sit it down and have a heart to heart talk with it, but it would die as it’s not a viable independent life form. Yes, you can argue that it’s alive, but only in the most rudimentary and dependent sense. You could also argue that a tumor is alive in the same manner.

          Again, it’s not your business. If you don’t think abortion is moral, you don’t have to have one, but until you are willing to take responsibility for the life you’re forcing on someone else, don’t deny that safe and legal right to someone you don’t know.

          • Karl Popp

            Your logic (or lack thereof) provides numerous problems.

            “Quote: “At a certain point, a fetus does become a viable lifeform, but that point is way beyond the customary timeframe that abortions take place.”

            Ah, I see. When is that time exactly? Upon exiting the womb? That’s a totally dependent, unproductive little critter. Age 1? Still unproductive and dependent. Age 13? Still not usually capable of rational decision-making and mostly dependent, but now with an attitude to boot.

            Quote: “You could also argue that a tumor is alive in the same manner.”

            I honestly knew you would go there. It’s pretty common for the left to think human life has no intrinsic value, but rather that their perceived “quality of life” is what matters.

            Quote: “Again, it’s not your business.”

            So why is it YOUR business to so nebulously determine when life begins? Seems hypocritical to me.

          • Jason_Donner

            Well, since you’ve been reduced to arguing semantics:

            1. I’m a little surprised I have to explain this, but by a “viable human being”, it’s rather obvious that I am talking about an independent life form capable of surviving outside its mother.

            2. Again, I’m a little surprise I have to explain this but I was using the tumor analogy to argue against your own point to show you how flawed it was.

            3. Here’s why this is my business. Because you and those like you seek to remove freedom from people. The freedom to determine the course of their own lives and the freedom to make determinations about their own health without government interference. I don’t care for abortion, but I do care about the freedom a young woman has over her own body. Any time a group of people grasp for a moral reason to deny freedom to a certain percentage of the population, I have a problem with it.

          • Karl Popp

            I understand your assertion about freedom. I simply think abortion is the ultimate denial of freedom and human rights for the unborn.

            Like I said, we’ll never see eye to eye. Hope you won’t mind if I still enjoy some of the stuff on your web site.

          • Jason_Donner

            I’m more concerned with protecting the freedom of actual living human beings over hypothetical ones, but that’s just me.

            All right… we’ll never see eye to eye. I’ll just stick to my opinion and you can continue being wrong, but I love that you enjoy the website and encourage you to continue.

          • Shane

            Sometimes abortion is a necessity! What about the “ultimate denial of freedom and human rights” for the already-born? You are just trading one life for another, so don’t try to take the high road because I’ll push you off it. And I don’t care if he minds. I do. I come here all the time and I don’t like your smell, so piss off.

        • Shane

          Don’t know how religious you are, but since the Spanish Inquisition was basically the Holocaust for women, it is nice of YOU to IGNORE a source you might believe in when conveinent for you. Religions have a way of murdering women and calling it “God’s Will” when the need suits them, yet if a woman has to make a choice like this (within reason, the choice is hers alone!), then religious nut-jobs all start threating to burn her at the stake (conveinently). So let’s not bring up religion in the same topic as morals, okay?

      • warptek

        End of debate? Oh yes, Master so wise. The interpretation of the scripture you quote above is not a biblical justification for abortion, fool. That particular passage is speaking about JEALOUSY as in It is not about abortion, it’s about Jealousy and the Lord acting as a witness in trials that otherwise had none. The New International Version is the ONLY version to use the word ‘miscarriage’. The translators interpret ‘Your thigh to rot’ and ‘to rot [your] thigh’ as ‘miscarriage’. Whereas the Hebrew for ‘thigh’, יָרֵ֑ךְ (yā·rêḵ), is translated elsewhere in the NIV Bible as ‘side’. “Gird your sword on your side, you mighty one; clothe yourself with splendor and majesty.” (Psalm 45:3 NIV). And the Hebrew for ‘to rot’, or ‘waste away’, נֹפֶ֥לֶת (nō·p̄e·leṯ), is translated elsewhere in the NIV as ‘to fall down’ (see Judges 19:27 NIV) Similarly, only a couple of translations even translate בֶּ֖טֶן (be·ṭen) and בִּטְנֵ֖ךְ (biṭ·nêḵ) as ‘womb’. The rest use ‘belly’ or ‘abdomen’.
        Interpreting these scriptures to mean abortion is isolated to the questionable translation given in the NIV and only the NIV.

        • Jason_Donner

          Given that The Bible is… you know… made up, you can interpret that piece of Bronze Age fanfiction all you want.

    • one_out_of_billion

      did god made you custodian of right and wrong? if you are pro life start adopting the ones who are dying of hunger in the world…you wont do that because that will create issues for you. you people are good for nothings who take sadistic pleasure in creating misery for others.

      • Karl Popp

        Thanks for your response. A bit of ad hominem nonsense can be entertaining every now and then.

      • Melody Lanzatella

        What does people dying of hunger in the world have to do with abortion exactly???

        • Jason_Donner

          You’re fond of your punctuation, aren’t you?

          I’m pretty sure our friend was referring to the idea that pro-lifers love the fetus, but hate the child. That most that want abortion banned do absolutely nothing to help the child once it’s brought into the world. I’m sure you’ll argue that’s not the case, so I’ll just point out the most damning statistic that says that if one out of every 500 pro-life supporters in the United States were to adopt one child out of the thousands in foster and respite care, there would be no children in foster or respite care.

        • one_out_of_billion

          nothing…but when anti abortion people choose to call themselves ‘pro life” it does, as the child dying of hunger is a human life lost that could have been saved…

  • Melody Lanzatella

    If that “fetus” has developed nerve endings, and can feel pain, it is torture and that makes it wrong….PERIOD!!!

    • Jason_Donner

      Why are you following a period with three exclamation marks?

      Anyway, the nerve endings and synapses you speak of don’t develop until 23-25 weeks of gestation and most abortions occur before the 13th week. In the event that a later term abortion has to be performed (again, usually because there is a complication in pregnancy that poses a physical risk to the mothers), it’s actually a law that the fetus be given anesthetic.

      So… no nerves, no pain… no torture.